OT - One very big step closer to MLS in Detroit
Looks like Wayne County has "chosen" the Dan Gilbert proposal for the fail-jail site downtown. "Chosen" in quotes because the Walsh proposal remains on the table officially, but the county is now in deeper negotiations with Gilbert and hopefully rolling toward a formal agreement. Great news for those of us wanting to see an MLS franchise in Detroit, as well as for anyone who appreciates simple common sense in their county governments.
http://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/local/wayne-county/2017/07/31/way…
Exactly.
I'd suggest that Gilbert doesn't have a particular, searing passion for Detroit, mind you. He did this in Cleveland before he did it in Detroit.
He just happens to be really savvy and plays to the particular passion that Detroiters have for their city to make it feel homegrown.
That garners a hard eye roll from me. Try to present an argument without a lazy attack like that
People have been investing in Downtown, Midtown and other areas before Gilbert realized the deal to be had in the city. Penske and Karmanos were already investing. Smaller groups were making small inroads with the money they had available. Gilbert is doing what everyone else has been doing, but on a larger scale.
He's not doing it on his own and just because he grabs the most headlines, it doesn't mean he's led the revival downtown.
That caters to a laser-focused few, when 99.99 percent of the people like myself want one of those "manufactured" teams.
If Detroit ever wants to be a big player in the MLS game, then those people are going to have to get over themselves.
...a manufactured team. It's a manufactured experience. Consider the atmosphere of the Palace or Comerica. To say nothing of the coming Little Caesars Arena. Where you have to have ferris wheels, whiskey bars, cigar lounges blah...blah...blah and you watch the game you bought a ticket for on TV. Where the team needs to exhort the crowd into cheering with whiz bang graphics. DCFC somehow draws 6,000 people to Hamtramck (of all places) for a third (or fourth?) division soccer team in a run down venue.
Get over themselves? They're just a bunch of people who love their team and love an authentic Detroit urban experience. You could argue the DCFC is as much in tune with Detroit's revitalization as Gores and Gilbert.
And yes, I know. Hamtramck is technically not Detroit but if you are going to argue that point you know knothing of the area.
Apples to oranges.
You think Portland and Seattle are manufactured experiences?? They were old NASL/USL teams who were "promoted" to MLS. Until Pro/Rel becomes a thing in the US (read: it won't), this is the only way to get to the top flight. The experience will still be top-notch. That's what blows my mind about the NGS twats.
1) The experience is what you make of it. Personally, I do not give a flying F about all the other things on the outside. And I would argue that the soccer fan is like the hockey fan in that they pay the most attention to the on-field experience compared to the other sports.
2) Yes, they need to get over themselves. There is a clearly obvious resentment from this fanbase towards getting an MLS team.
The fact that Detroit City plays its games in Hamtramck is such an appropriate metaphor for the club and its pretentious fanbase.
..I can say that while there are a lot of passionate fans(some of my closest friends go all the time), many of the people that go to the games go for the same reason people go to Tigers, Wings, Lions, etc. games....the experience. A large portion of the north guard has no clue what the hell is going on in the game because they are so busy doing the chants and songs, but that can be fun for them. There is a large hipster feel to the demographic which I think is why you see such opposition to an MLS team. Things are cool when not many people do it, but once it's mainstream it's no longer cool. MLS in Detroit wouldn't make DCFC go away, as someone mentioned before, it would actually increase opportunities for players, make the club better.
The issue is indigenous v. manufactured.Ah, that "indigenous" Detroit City Football Club, founded all of five years ago, with its totally original traditions like using smoke bombs in the stands.
It's amazing how exclusive DCFC people are about their team. It's almost as if they don't even like soccer--only all the goofy stuff their weird fanbase does.
"fan culture and grassroots stuff"... Yeesh.
The owners help organize alot of things in the community. And actually care about the residents around where the team is located. They do make a significant impact considering the size of the team compared to pro teams in major leagues. That is the kind of stuff that I would hope would continue and would be requirement for me in being satisfied with a MLS Detroit-DCFC partnership.
I don't think they need to be all for this if a partnership is going to negatively affect those relationships that have already been built. If Gores/Gilbert come in and put their own people in charge that have a certain way of doing things instead of a grassroots approach, then why should DCFC fans be supportive of that? Obviously this is all hypothetical, but DCFC can do just fine without MLS. And MLS would probably do just fine without DCFC.
Found the NGS guy.
"DCFC can do just fine"
If all you ever want is 3rd/4th tier soccer in Detroit forever, yeah...they'll still exist but why wouldn't you want top-flight footy here? It's not like pro/rel will ever happen in the US.
...been to a DCFC game? To say they don't like soccer is, to be charitable, uninformed.
I've been to some. There are definitely a lot of people at the games who care more about the Authentic Soccer Fan Experience (TM) in the stands than the action on the field.
But tbh I'm afraid of being judged for not being a hardcore enough of a fan.
that's awesome....needed something else to replace spartan football anyways.
100 percent fantastic news.
I laugh at anyone who thinks they won't get a strong turnout at these games. There is such a massive support system, especially in the Metro Detroit areas for soccer.
And to the guy above about the DCFC fanbase, that's just something they'll have to deal with. I know it's a very elite group of passionate supporters, but there is a MUCH larger potential fanbase that wants to follow a national Detroit team.
elitist; not elite. or maybe even snobby / judgemental.
Good news indeed
I've been pining for a Detroit MLS team for years. It'd give me something to follow other than baseball in the summer.
Long live Trevor Francis! He may have been the best talent (considering he was in his prime) to play in any American Pro soccer league. He then became the UK's first million pound transfer fee player going to Nottingham Forrest.
Can't wait to see what sort of talent a Detroit MLS team will have.
another lousy professional team in this town. /s
DCFC as an MLS franchisee would be great. It would be even better if the additon came with a system of promotion/relegation - that would jumpstart professional soccer in the U.S. more than any other move I can think of.
Tried to offer MLS a massive amount of money to sponsor them and install that very system.
And of course they said no.
Once expansion continues to happen, which it will, having P/R is almost a necessity.
MLS is contractually obligated to not re-negotiate TV/Streaming contracts until 2021. That is why they "of course" turned it down.
August 1st, 2017 at 12:33 AM ^
That was a PR move by the guy in Miami whose USL team is about to get squeezed out. He has no money, let alone the $4 billion that was reported in the headline, he is a charlatan.
And no, the owners will never allow this, just like owners in the NBA, NFL, MLB, NHL would never put their hundreds of millions of dollars-asset at risk, and you wouldn't take your secure investment in your house and instead just voluntarily opt to put it up to risk of 24/1 odds that the value drops by 75%. Promotion/relegation is just flat out too foreign a construct to work in the United States.
And without pro/rel, MLS is growing at a fantastic rate for a 20 year old league, and the idea that it's necessary smacks of eurosnobbery, with a dollop of internet-era immediate satisfaction/impatience. 20 years from now, MLS will be a top 10 league in the world.
I would rather see a whole new MLS team with a whole new identity, and some kind of amicable feeder agreement between DCFC and the MLS team. I think everyone would be happier that way, because I think you'd see two reactions from DCFC supporters if the team basically sold to Gilbert: 1) mega-hipster resentment toward "selling out" and therefore boycotting the team or 2) mega-hipster resentment toward "newcomers" who only like it after it was cool. Rather see Gilbert start from scratch.
Without Illitch, Gilbert, Karmanos, Etc . . . Detroit would be a ghost town.
Today, The city has a lot of momentum. Sure, the neighborhoods have issues and challenges . . . but, you don't go 50+ years of social and physcial decay without them. But, the physical look and feel of downtown/midtown/rivertown, corktown, eastern market is getting better. We are seeing traction that I thought I would never see. I worked down there 10 years ago . . . now, I wish my office was located there.
At some point, these guys are controlling what they can control . . . They can put security in to augment the Police. They are attracting younger people and empty nesters with amentities. And, the quality of life has improved a lot. The parks from Belle Isle west to the Bridge is killer.
Let's be thankful that post-bankruptcy renaiassance is actually receiving traction; There is plenty of room for everyone to benefit . . . from average janes and joes . . . to the Billionares.
August 1st, 2017 at 10:16 AM ^
August 1st, 2017 at 12:05 PM ^
Common misconception - the city had nothing to do with that decision. All Wayne County. Which, yes, was completely typical of the horseshit way the county was governed up through the end of the Ficano admin.
The MLS is trying to push past its retirement home for has beens and never was image and into a legitimate league. There is a problem with that, there isn’t enough talent. The league is stretched too thin and the new strategy of each team having an NASL side as a minor league/feeder affiliate hasn’t proven to be successful or even viable yet.
The new chivas and the Miami beckhams have yet to join to say nothing of other teams who think they’re in line like Charlotte, San Diego et al and at present the talent isn’t there to support the current 22. The MLS has always been patchy in terms of talent but this is going to lead to some horrific sides. LA have probably the richest vein of talent in the country and even they haven’t been able to produce local talent much beyond the current starting squad of their NASL side.
I’m sure this will probably happen at some point but the league is starting to show signs of growing pains and more teams without a better youth development program isn’t going to change that
I can tell you with dead certainty that I won't be able to tell the difference between a Detroit vs. San Diego MLS game and Real Madrid vs. Barca. It's like wine - I just like it and I'm pretty sure I like it better not knowing the difference between good and bad. I doubt I'm alone. That, or people will just enjoy having a hometown team to rally around. I mean, people aren't packing a semi-pro soccer stadium in Hamtramck for elite soccer.
Unfortunate Hot Take: The currently nonexistant MLS team will be the next major franchise to win a championship in Detroit.
As an FCC season ticket holder, I hope you're right. On the other hand, the Detroit media market is something like 4 or 5 times as large as Cincinnati. I *think* Cincy skews a little younger, but I don't have the data to back up.
On the other hand, I flipped on ESPN a couple of months ago and watched NYCFC play the Sounders in the rain, at Yankee Stadium in a game that was almost unwatchable. There were probably fans at the game, but you couldn't see them on the TV broadcast because baseball stadiums are atrocious set ups for soccer.
MLS goes on and on about how much they value soccer specific stadiums and homegrown displays of fan support, but at the end of the day, they keep plopping teams in major media markers, on-field product and fan experience be damned. So I hope CIncy and Sacramento get the bids (and Detroit gets in during the next round) but I'm not exactly holding my breath.
Not getting into MLS wouldn't be the end of the world because the club could keep playing at Nippert. Hate the idea of putting the new stadium in Newport, but also hate the idea of he city funding another stadium. Only a few years away from the bengals asking for a new stadium, and let's be honest the NFL has peaked.
August 1st, 2017 at 10:11 AM ^
Despite all the arguing and name calling I've read so far, I really fail to see this as a bad thing. Detroit, for decades, has quite literally been crumbling and rotting away. The population is half of what it was 15 years ago. Half. In 2009 200,000 people left the city, more than the entire population of Michigans second largest city, Grand Rapids. Someone is going to build something in Detroit? Good. Any chance at stimulating growth and revenue should be welcome.