OT - Who would you vote for Most Overrated Player?

Submitted by canzior on May 2nd, 2018 at 2:55 PM

Slow day..but curious. Who do you think is the most overrated player in a sport? Maybe not the entire sport, perhaps by position?

Also/Or...most overrated/dissappointing player coming into or going out of Michigan in any sport?

Maybe overrated isn't the right word, but I had high expectations for for D. Terrell and Edwards heading into the NFL.

 

For transparency, this was inspired my opinion that Brett Favre is the most overrated player in NFL history. 

Comments

Valiant

May 2nd, 2018 at 5:43 PM ^

Sixth.  All-time.  And in fewer seasons than anyone else in the top 16.

This alone qualifies him for the Hall of Fame.

As to the other stuff - the "intangibles" - I suppose it can be debated how much they contributed to the 5 championships, but as a Yankee fan, I appreciated that he played hard every day, never made excuses and carried himself with class throughout his career.

A2toGVSU

May 2nd, 2018 at 3:22 PM ^

He is certainly overrated. He had a stellar baseball career, but based on anything you read about him, you'd think that during his career, he would have cured cancer, won a Nobel, and donated 99% of his earnings to feed, clothe, and educate less fortunate kids. We can all agree Jeter is one of the all time greats, but the media love for him far exceeds his accomplishments.

SC Wolverine

May 3rd, 2018 at 12:55 PM ^

The gold gloves are where the problem lies.  That should be an honored award to recognize top notch excellence.  Yet Jeter was a below average shortstop by advanced metrics and he kept collecting the gold gloves.  Other than that, sure, he was awesome -- and I can say that as a lifelong Red Sox fan.  

cm2010

May 2nd, 2018 at 3:24 PM ^

people tend to talk about him like he's the MJ of baseball. He was a good hitter for a long time (while not a great defender) and was a key cog on 5 championship teams. He's certainly worthy of the HOF, but he falls well short of a Mount Rushmore of baseball players.

hailtothevictors08

May 2nd, 2018 at 3:53 PM ^

Baseball is effectively an individual sport and championships are a team award. 

 
Jeter was a very good player, for a long time however:
 
1. He played for the Yankees, who have a huge fanbase who make a god out of their players. I have Yankee friends who basically think he was one of the best ever. This is biggest on defense, where he never had a good defensive WAR, even at his peak, and was really bad THE back half of his career.
 
(Cue: BUT REMEMBER THAT ONE TIME HE DOVE INTO THE STANDS, HE HAS SO MUCH HEART. AND THAT PLAY AGAINST THE As, HE IS A GREAT DEFENDER) 
 
1b. Those Yankee teams were loaded beyond belief. Pretend for a moment he put up the same numbers in say Kansas City .... 
 
2. Baseball's postseason is an incredibly low sample size event in which Jeter had some admittedly great moments.
 
3. His last 5 seasons, he was just not very good. His last two, he was awful. Basically, the level of an average triple A replacement player. 
 
4. He was a great ambassador for the game and loved, or at least respected, by almost all. This is directly correlated to being a Yankee and not a Royal, and the low sample size success in the playoffs.
 
In sum, baseball is an individual massive sample size stats game, and the big arguments for Jeter are team awards, individual GRITTY/CLUTCH moments, and the fact he was a Yankee.
 
Great player, obvious Hall of Famer (probably deservedly so but not as clear cut as many assume), not close to the level many consider him to be. 

schreibee

May 2nd, 2018 at 3:58 PM ^

Well, I mean, it is a team game, right? Jeter didn't win 5 Grand Slam tennis or golf titles, right?

He can be a very good player, HOFer even, on great teams, and still be overrated. Right?

His raw advanced metric stats ID him as a fantastic player who would not be thought of in nearly the same light if he'd toiled 20 pennant-less years for the Mariners or Pirates.

Pretty much end of discussion, I think. No one's saying he sucked, just that he may be more popular than great.

MGoCali

May 2nd, 2018 at 4:23 PM ^

He was on great teams. He was a great player too. A top 20 all time offensive player. His defense was grossly overrated though, and that was annoying. He wasn't a top 1000 all time defensive player, yet he won five gold gloves in his thirties when his defense was in decline. 

Baseball is really hard to judge. There are so many attachments to counting stats and longevity, and some of that is deserved. I think the five rings speaks volumes. Clearly a hall of famer, and no one would deny that. I think it's just the defense that should be removed from the pedestal. 

Kevin13

May 2nd, 2018 at 4:48 PM ^

and people saying Jeter is over rated. I actually think Cal Ripken is a little over rated.  Yes he was an iron man and I tip my hat to that, but many will say he hurt the team at times just to keep that streak going and the last few years he was a shell of himself and probably should've been sat down, but the manager wasn't going to stop his streak.

He is definitely a HOF player, but I think the streak put him on a pedestal that probably isn't as deserved as some make him out to be.

jbrandimore

May 2nd, 2018 at 5:35 PM ^

The 1998 season was known for 3 things.

 

#1 Mark McGwire hitting 72 home runs

#2 Sammy Sosa hitting 66 home runs

#3 Cal Ripken playing in his 2,632nd consecutive game

I'll let you all make your own judgements on whether only 2 of these things are related, or all three of them are.

bronxblue

May 2nd, 2018 at 5:14 PM ^

It wasn't that he was overrated on some vast scale, only hearing Jeter mentioned in the same breath as some of the greatest players in the league always felt extreme.  He was an extremely good hitter and, at best, an average defender at his peak.  His playoff batting numbers were good (308/374/465), but certainly not transcendent.  He did hit well for his position (he won a number of Silver Slugger awards and was consistently a leader in WAR for his position), but his peak made him look like a top 10-15 SS (think Trammel and Larkin), not necessary the legend he's treated as.  

And I wouldn't read too much into simply winning championships; Robert Horry has 7(!!) NBA titles to his name and never even made an All-Star team.  

Jeter was a really good player for a long time, but his greatest achievement was playing in NY and winning titles on some really good teams.  Had he played his career in, I don't know, Houston and maybe won 1 title, I doubt he'd be treated quite as well.

Matte Kudasai

May 3rd, 2018 at 8:15 AM ^

Bronxblue says his greatest acheivement was "playing in NY and winning titles on some really good teams"

A top 10-15 ss similiar to Trammell?  You mean other than having 1100 more hits than Trammell?

Fuck, for a minute I thought you were talking about the player with the 6th most hits in the history of the game.

bronxblue

May 3rd, 2018 at 1:02 PM ^

Congrats to Jeter on also getting 3000 more at-bats than Trammell.  Jeter has more countable stats because he played longer, which is as much to do with the different eras they played in as an actual difference in ability between the two players.    

Oh, and Trammell was profoundly better as a defender - pick your favorite metric, but Jeter was a much worse defender than Alan, and was probably even worse than the metrics show because he had such limited range that he oftentimes wasn't even able to get to the area where plays could conceivably get made.

Again, Jeter is a very good player.  But the production on the field didn't reach to the level of the platitudes he received both during his career and beyond.  If you've got more evidence to back up your claims beyond "exactly as many more hits as you'd expect given the number of additional ABs he got" and "ringzzz", please share it.

Tom Snow

May 2nd, 2018 at 2:59 PM ^

Brett Favre overrated. That sure is one hot take. I am no Favre fan and hated the Packers, but can't deny that he was one hell of a player. 

Lou MacAdoo

May 2nd, 2018 at 11:56 PM ^

Yes, but when he took those chances and succeeded it was spectacular. He’s made some of the most incredible throws in the history of the game. He was a gamer, fierce competitor, supremely confident, and a gambler. These same traits were what led to his downfall too. I mean what other guy in his position would send a dick pick to Jen selter? That takes cajones and I just gotta think he probably thought it was worth the risk. Just like throwing into triple coverage. What if he succeeded? Well, it would’ve been spectacular.

CLion

May 2nd, 2018 at 3:07 PM ^

Ehh, I think he's a little overrated. He was a ton of fun to watch in his prime and was pretty damn good for a couple years, but he only won one super bowl and was not the MVP in that one (some random kick return specialist won the award). I'd take Rodgers over Favre.